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Cognitive Dissonance

I write for the WoD. Current project is for the WoD. I know the WoD system rather well.

Tonight, I ran (FSVO[0]) Scion: Hero.

Despite my complaints below, I believe people enjoyed Scion. As did I. I have to compare to the WoD system or I'll go insane.

There's a reason I've got whisky. And then bed.

[0]: There are no rules in the demo for how to do damage when grappling[1], despite making that damage lethal being one of the powers on offer for a pregen character. Likewise, nowhere does it say what you roll to attack. For the first fight, I honestly thought that relic weapons were the shit, as I was having people roll Dex + Firearms[2] + Accuracy. Nowhere did it mention that the pregens had their Dex and Firearms already added in, or whether they had other bonuses. One of the first rules of demo games is "Be explicit, people do not know your system."
[1]: I don't care if it's a demo, do not say "does damage equal to a clinch" if that's the only mention of the word "clinch" in the whole fucking file. It's not just unprofessional, it means I have to pull things out of my arse. And I've no idea how your system interacts as it's very different from any of the ones I know.
[2]: "Marksman", what fucking ever. The worst was "Do you have any epic Presence?" "Dude, Presence isn't an Attribute." Argh. Why the hyper-rules system relies on an Attribute spread widely regarded as b0rked is beyond me, when the WoD moved on and found a nicer spread.

Comments

( 13 informants — We want information! )
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 12:03 am (UTC)
I have never run the Demo, but it sucks they did not port the chinch damage. its on the weapon chart in the book.

Marksman is not a great name, but I guess they wanted to put all the ranged skills togather. Better then using "archery" for fire guns in exalted I guess.

I will be trying nWoD for the first time Friday we will see what I make of the Attributes. I am guessing they just chose to keep the Exalted ones, based on the oWoD ones.
etherlad
Oct. 12th, 2007 01:58 am (UTC)
The nWOD spread is very elegant. Should have been done like this long ago.

The columns are familiar: Mental, Physical, Social. But this time, there are defined rows, as well: Power, Finesse, and Resistance.

So, you have Intelligence as Mental/Power, Dexterity as Physical/Finesse, Composure as Social/Resistance, and so on. It makes a lot of sense and flow really well.
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 08:26 am (UTC)
Right. I noted as much just have not seen them in play. The only thing I don't like is the lack of a more focused perception stat.
digitalraven
Oct. 12th, 2007 12:34 pm (UTC)
Perception's handled as Wits + Composure for general subconscious awareness, or Wits + Skill for active tasks relating to the skill. Which I like, as it means you don't have the annoying overlap of a stat for noticing stuff and a skill for... err... noticing stuff. But then Alertness/Awareness always rubbed me the wrong way.
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 10:46 pm (UTC)
Wits+ composure...OK, Goons subconcious awareness is better then I thought.

Your stat/skill for noticing stuff is a fair criticism. I viewed awareness as more an ability to monitor surroundings and and notice wrong things then anything else (high awareness people being less likly to be mugged, for example), while Perception is more broad. However, what you note is true, and that is my interpertation of Awareness, not necessarily something the books themselves said.
inscrutable
Oct. 12th, 2007 02:07 am (UTC)
You haven't tried the nWoD yet? It's good stuff. I've been really impressed with Vampire, Promethean and Changeling.
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 08:25 am (UTC)
Oh, I have no doubt it's good. I just have several hundred dollars worth of Vampire books now. ;-)

But I am not one of those "nWoD sucks blah blah" people.

I am playing a Promethean in the nWoD game tomorrow/tongiht. gonna be an odd group, with a werewolf, changeling, and 2 mages.
digitalraven
Oct. 12th, 2007 12:43 pm (UTC)
It's very different. The two systems' common predecessor is the AEonverse system. Exalted, then Ex2, then Scion, all tweak the system to present interesting tactical challenges in the rules (the difference between a high-DV/low-Soak beastie and its inverse).

WoD, on the other hand, goes to a whole new level of abstractness. One die roll (not even a contested roll) to see if you hit someone bad enough to put the hurt on, and combat mechanics that simulate the balls-to-the-wall "oh fuck" nature of combat and that really shine when the protagonists blow Willpower from their desperate need to kill the other cunt first. Which doesn't mean you can't do something impressive---a pack of Uratha dealt 17 lethal damage to the spirit of the Great Fire of London in the game I ran at ConCrete Cow. But that's the batshit insane exception, not the norm.

I'm being incoherent today.
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 10:42 pm (UTC)
right. Thats kinda the idea I got. Given the nature of the game I don't mind that at all.

I follow you.
digitalraven
Oct. 12th, 2007 12:37 pm (UTC)
Yeah. A lot of it read like sections copy/pasted in from the corebook. Which saves on writers, but leads to... oversights like those I mention. I was hoping for something more like the Exalted or old WoD quickstarts, which had a designed-that-way cut down system. Then again, I've been meaning to create Quickstart-compatible rules for all the Exalted splats simply so I can entice some of my less rules-focused players into the setting.
baronsamedi
Oct. 12th, 2007 10:43 pm (UTC)
Yea I had the old Exalted quickstart, I do recall what you meant.

its a fair criticism.
brain_hurts
Oct. 12th, 2007 07:56 am (UTC)
it was rather good.
and very headfucky as you ran it.
digitalraven
Oct. 13th, 2007 09:06 am (UTC)
I'm glad you enjoyed it. The 2-as-1 certainly seemed to work.
( 13 informants — We want information! )

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